Lemongrove,i hadnt seen this report from the Nolan website till now,if only cancer was just an interruption,if only…
Yes Dib, and when people like Bernie Nolan refer to cancer as just an interruption, it reduces it to the level of a tummy bug, or a cold - and what does that do to raise awareness?
Do we maybe need a separate thread about secondary breast cancer and how it is perceived by the public… or secondary bc affecting “celebrities” and how it is reported in the media… and keep this thread specific to Bernie Nolan?
If so, I wonder how many of you primary bc people would look at it? It would need to be in the Living with Breast Cancer section, I think, not in the Secondaries or “Have I got secondary” sections.
I’m thinking of starting such a thread but I’ll leave it until after my onc visit this week… hoping that someone else takes it up if it’s a helpful idea.
I feel that we are somewhat using Bernie Nolan’s name in vain. The title of the thread is provocative in that women, especailly young women first being diagnosed, will be reading the thread because they think its to do with Bernie Nolan only to find a debate that they may find distressing.
A new title which reflected the debate would be better as it would at least give women the choice of whether they wanted to join in or indeed read about the subject matter.
Sorry, this thread is not using Bernie Nolans name in vain. She made statements, and it is fair to refer to them. Also with regard to the suggestion that we need a separate thread? This issue effects everyone with BC, whether they have primary or secondary BC. What is that you think people might find distressing about saying that Bernie Nolan has provided misinformation and caused confusion about BC? No doubt those who prefer to bury their heads in the sand and want to read about cures etc, find it comforting, but it just isn’t like that, and ultimately is very damaging to pretend it is.
By the way, although Bernie has now acknowledged her cancer is now incurable, she has not acknowledged that it was wrong to suggest she had beaten it. In fact she is still talking about beating cancer. In the 5th November issue of Hello magazine, she spoke of her determination to beat cancer with a revolutionary drug called T-DM1. The fact is this drug will not beat BC, and has been shown to extend life by only around six months (and in anycase it has not been authorised for use in Europe yet). won’t this mislead and give false hope to some with stage 4 BC, and misinform the public?
Can i just clarify my earlier post as it may have been misunderstood. I was just concerned that by specifically quoting something from Graham Norton show on the site that was incorrect could lead to consequences (given everything in the news at the moment) and stuff on here may be passed on in other forums/facebook ect. Evedryone is entilted to their views and to share those views and I respect that we are all different and have different ways of handling/saying things. I am not particularly a Bernie fan and havens’t trawled the internet to find things to prove myself right or wrong - I just wanted to alert people to a potential problem - I know we all want to make a difference that is why we use the forums to support people and make our points and we do need to make sure that Breast Cancer is represented in the right way in media and that people understand that its not a ‘trivial’ disease.
Please leave this thread as it is. The only reason I still bother to pop into the forums after the latest new site shambles is because of interesting threads such as this one. This thread is clearly signposted as being in the secondaries section so anyone reading the thread should be in no doubt.
I tread tentatively into this thread, as someone who first saw it in the “latest posts section” and so didn’t instantly see it was in the secondary section. Obviously I see that now, and understand how Bernie’s statements can cause and clearly are causing upset. Maybe having two sisters with breast cancer led her to look at in a different way, I don’t know. But I understand that her words will have caused distress to people.
I’m still awaiting my appointment at breast clinic, so don’t even know what I’m facing, if anything. But one thing I still remember was reading Roy Castles biography years ago. I remember Fiona Castle saying how much she hated the phrase “battling cancer”, because for her it wasn’t a battle. That would suggest something you could train and fight against.
Language is a powerful thing. The language around any illness will therefore cause emotions of some sort.
Thank you Belinda.
It has become apparent to me that posters to this thread had divided into three clear groups. The first group are those with primary BC who feel comforted by talk of cures, all clear, beating cancer etc, and get very aggressive when forced to confront the reality that things are far more complex (and this small group post repeatedly). The second group are those with secondary BC, who actually know the score, and recognise that the language used by Bernie Nolan (and other celebs), is reductionist, and damaging. The third group are those with primary BC, who recognise that BC is a complex disease, and that hope is not enough. This group know that as far as BC is concerned ignorance is not bliss - rather the more a person knows the better their chance of survival.
Safronseed, I think you’re comments are rather pedantic. While Bernie did not use the words all clear on the Graham Norton Show, she certainly used words that amounted to the same thing. Also, the press release that accompanied her appearance on the show said " Bernie Nolan, all clear of BC". Additionally, on the Nolans Official website, she did claim to have beaten cancer etc, etc, so she has clearly used those terms. That being the case I do think it is slightly offensive to compare what I and others have posted on this thread, to what happened on Twitter, concerning Lord McAlpine. On Twitter, posters wrongly accused Lord McAlpine of the most heinous crime, without any evidence whatsoever, and that is clearly not the case here.
- Lemongrove, Just to clarify (repeating my earlier post). I was concerned that by specifically quoting something from Graham Norton show on the site that was incorrect could lead to consequences (given everything in the news at the moment) and stuff on here may be passed on in other forums/facebook etc. Everyone is entitled to their views and to share those views and I understand that we are all different and have different ways of handling/saying things. I am not particularly a Bernie fan and haven’t trawled the internet to find things to prove myself right or wrong - I just wanted to alert people to a potential problem – Some may think I am being pedantic others may not but I acknowledge and respect everyones views on this.
Saffronseed the point is I did not quote something that was incorrect or untrue. In your earlier post you accused me of attributing comments to Bernie Nolan which were untrue, and potentially defamatory. I provided evidence to support what I have posted, but you have not withdrawn your comments. However, I respect your right to express an opinion, and as I want us all to be on the sme side/do not want this thread to dissolve into acrimony, I will write this off as a communication error.
What started out as a decent thread has put me off somewhat as time goes on. I have read the posts but will not be posting on this subject again as the tone has put me off and I am sure I am not alone in this. I understand everyone’s point but I do think that the subject should now be closed. But again that is just my opinion. Val
Val - agreed - its getting a bit tiresome and seem to have strayed off the original points but I suspect that someone else will the want the ‘last word’ and maybe then we can get closure lol… xx
Moderators - do you think you could close this thread now? I think it would be appropriate. Thanks
Thanks for your post lizcat, I will pass it on for Leah/Mike tomorrow but we can ‘consider’ it closed for now if that’s ok with everyone
Kind regards
Lucy
Glad you agree Liz and saffronseed. I hope the thread will now be closed as it has served its purpose. But enough is enough.
I find it very sad that the thread will be closed because a few people have posted offensive and aggressive posts. As far as I’m concerned the posts by those of us with secondary cancer have been very tolerant and courteous - so it’s very unfair that a thread that was started in the secondaries section, and intended for people with secondary BC, has been hijacked and ultimately closed by those with primary BC, simply because their hostility. What makes me even sadder, is that these people seem to think it’s OK to gloss over the experience and suffering of people with secondary cancer, just so they can continue to bury their heads in the sand and feel comfortable.
Lemongrove you are right to be sad that the thread will be closed but i do feel your comments have contributed to the closure.
I have followed this thread for sometime without posting but feel very strongly that the post you have just put on here is very unfair. Anyone that has/have had a diagnosis of breast cancer whether primary or secondary has a right to a view without being judged.
No-one has the right to judge others especially when we are all travelling a similar road whether it be primary or secondary
But perhaps it’s because we are not travelling a similar road this thread is having to close? I don’t know how primary patients feel about being initially diagnosed and then having to make important treatment and any surgery decisions as I was diagnosed stage 4 from the very beginning. However much I would like to empathise I’ve not had the experience. I only know a secondary diagnosis puts you in an entirely different place and your treatment is deemed palliative care only. This thread, even in Latest Posts is clearly marked as being in the Living with Secondary Breast Cancer forum. Of course it’s open for anyone, quite rightly, to comment here but perhaps it’s shown how great the differences are between having a primary diagnosis and living with stage 4 breast cancer.
All I can say,as a primary,is that the fear I have Of a recurrence,though still strong,doesn’t fill me as much fear as it used to and that is because of the ladies on here who are still living their lives some years on from their secondary diagnosis.I take a lot of comfort from these threads and I certainly don’t underestimate the devastating consequences of secondary BC having nursed my mum through her final weeks of life.My best wishes go to all BC ladies whether primary or secondary.
Do.x