Although i dont have secondries (hopefully stay that way) i have always read about Lisa and reading her mothers posting about the PM got me thinking.
Every now and agin there is a media drive for ‘organ donation’. After reading Sues posting i think there should be a media drive for leaving our bodies to science.
I am not saying we are all going to die from cancer but because when we all do die we will all have had it and had treatment.
I am going to tell my family that i wish my body to me left to science as it might help.
I agree entirely, pineapple. I’ve always made it clear to family that the medics can have any part of my body, but I know I have to put that in writing. Having said that, my mother put it in writing, she died in hospital, we’d said all along to the hospital she wanted her body donating, but there was some kind of hitch and in the end they couldn’t/didn’t/wouldn’t use any parts.
Good luck to us all.
Maureen xx
There are several issues here, that all of us need to think through.
I have carried a donor card for many years and I remember when I was told that I had cancer and 3 weeks later that it had spread, the realisation that I could no longer help others physically in this way after my death.
Regarding research, I signed the form about use of tissue samples and I would have no objection to a post-mortem if thought necessary.
However, donation of a whole body to science is maybe a different issue - Zotam’s post (in the Secondary section) should be read carefully.
And of course our own beliefs, ideas and thoughts about “afterwards”- and whether or not it matters to us and to our families what actually happens to the physical body - these are important too.
A serious subject… good to think about it while we are in a position to do so.
Does anyone know if there is actually a shortage of bodies which have had cancer? I know there is a general shortage for medical students but not sure if cancerous ones are in demand.
I’m not in the least religious and have thought in the past about leaving my body to med. science but somehow I still feel odd about my body not being at my funeral. Now where does that one come from?
Jane
Hi again there …
… I am hoping that doing the PM on Lisa has helped others … I am assured that it will. Lisa died suddenly and so we were in such shock and I didn’t even think about tissue donation or PM until the Dr asked the next day … he was the one who had made really good friends with Lisa and was the same age as her and so I knew that he was empathetic and sympathetic … he was in tears too the night she died and gave me such a hug. After agreeing I thought a lot about it and KNEW that Lisa would have wanted it had she been asked.
In a funny way it is reassuring to know that all the treatment last year had worked on the cancer in her body ( I want to tell her … maybe she knows) and it must make some of you feel that its all worth it however down you must feel having chemo and also frightened about having a mastectomy, that it worked and the cancer had gone from all those areas. If this has happened and some of you feel reassured and hopeful then that alone has been worth us agreeing to the PM.
Simon ( her fiance) didn’t want whole organs taken but agreed to tissue being taken. He had this ‘thing’ about medical students poking about with his beautiful Lisa’s organs! although he was reassured it wouldn’t be like that. Knowing Lisa as I did she would have agreed to the whole body being used but Simon would have been too upset so that was fine with me.
Lisa was really upset when she realised that she could no longer donate her organs to others if she died.
I think its for individuals to decide on. If you don’t feel like leaving your whole body maybe you could make enquiries about leaving tissue or some organs to be tested if you die or just ask about a PM. I am sure it will all help in this long battle and research as to how we get this darned disease and how to stop it killing us.
Its very much down to each person I think and no one should be pushed but I don’t blame Drs for asking.
I watched my lovely Lisa leave her body … I could tell the second she had gone … she was no longer there and so it was just her body that they were doing a PM on. She often used to say that your body is just’ your house’ while you are here on earth.
She did 2 years nursing training some years ago and volunteered to watch a PM (through glass) but was so excited about it afterwards!
Love Sue x
Maybe Jane they would just take what they want and so the rest of your body would be at your funeral. Its a strange subject I know but something must be done to stop this damned disease. There are so many different types of breast cancer thats the difficult bit I am sure. They don’t know yet why Lisa’s cancer in her brain was growing so rapidly but nowhere else … but hopefully they will find out or at least find a way to get that chemo into the brain in the first place.
I am afraid I am not now religious … admittedly I was sat on the fence before this happened to Lisa. Someone even brought her a Madonna filled with holy water back from Lourdes 10 days before she died and she had it in hospital.
Boy did it help throwing that as far as I could down the garden when I got home that night !!
Love Sue x
Hi Sue
My big thing at the moment about cancer research is that not enough is being done to investigate the process by which cancer spreads (the process of metastesis). Far more research is being done by pharmaceuticals on finding yet more chemotherapy drugs to shrink tumours…and most chemotherapy drugs only work in most people for a short time…so getting more and more drugs which just give incremental incrsaes to life isn’t in my book much progress. Lisa may well have been NED in the rest of her body when she died but a few months later cancer would have returned. What we desperatly need is drugs which will stop cancer spreading.
I read a brillaint article on this subject from Fortune Magazine called: Why we’re losing the war on cancer (and how to win it) This link should get you there: money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2004/03/22/365076/index.htm
I think the Madonna from Lourdes went the right place…
best wishes
Jane
Hi,
one of my friend’s Fathers left his body to science. Having lost my own lovely Dad, while on a holiday abroad where he had to be embalmed before being sent home in a zinc lined coffin at a cost of £25,000,( fortunately the insurance covered the cost of this), I was quite shocked by the idea. I was thrown by him having 2 autopsies, as the UK would not accept the Spanish one. I spared her my thoughts on it but was really shocked that there would be no funeral or celebration of his life. His final journey came via letters to say where his body was. Some 18 months later she said, I went to Dad’s funeral. This was the limit of time he could be held and the remains had to be cremated, no option. The doc who had his body during this time gave a nice speech about how grateful they were. My friend was not able to take any part, just allowed to attend where and when they said. She was happy with this as she had trained as a physiotherapist and was given a cadaver to learn her skills on.
I don’t mean to scare here as I do admire anyone who is willing to give so much, but take care for those left behind, who cannot have the funeral and move on for a long time.
Wishing you peace with the decision that is right for you
Lily x
I must admit I agree with you Jane about lack of research and only pushing the drugs that seem to temporarily stop the spread and line the pockets of the pharmaceutical companies. Its why I wonder if the way to go is PMs and then to compare similar women with similar symptoms and spread. This is what they were going to do with Lisa’s findings because there have been 3 women in their 30s with similar symptoms as Lisa who died within the last 4 years in the area … not exactly the same but similar enough to want to do the PM and keep all tissue together for further research. The young Dr that I mentioned is a research Dr hence his keen interest.
I also agree that possibly Lisa’s cancer would have spread back into her body from her brain even if that hadn’t killed her first. I am also not convinced that radiotherapy does all it is supposed to. Probably coincidence but every time Lisa had rads another problem occurred immediately.
At least after the PM I now know that she would have suffered much more had she not died that day of pneumonia, which incidentally came on very suddenly … they can tell that from looking at the lungs and can tell that she hadn’t had pneumonia for long … probably only that day but was severe enough to kill her. It doesn’t help my missing her so dreadfully and having really dark days, but at least its a little consolation why she had to go just then.
I was told that they used to call pneumonia the ‘old man’s friend’ because it killed elderly people before they suffered any longer from their illness.
Now how did I get into all that?!
Sue x
I have just reread my first posting on this and want to apologise to Sue. It sounds as though i am talking about you as if you are not here to read all this. I hope you dont mind me talking about the PM they preformed on Lisa.
I didnt email you before because i honestly didnt know what to say to you as i have a 20 year old daughter. What you have gone through is every parents absolute worst nightmare, and i would gladly die myself to save the life of my children. No mother should have to bury their child and my heart goes out to you.
I have always felt stronly about organ donation but then cancer made me redundant in that department. Aftter reading your post about the PM made me realise that maybe there is some other way to be of use. Of course we have to think about the people we leave behind but we would also be doing this by leaving our bodies for research etc to help make their lives cancer (or other terrible disease) free one day. Maybe if you can give your body up but say leave the heart for cremation? so the family have something to go through the ‘saying goodbye’ process -i dont know i am just thinking out loud. I hope i havent upset anyone.
I didn’t mind at all Pineapple. I just hope that anything I do or say can help in any way. After going through the hell that we have been through this last year and a half … Lisa died only 13 months after dx … I find that I am not the sort to get easily offended. Sure makes you get your priorities right!
Love Sue x