Hi everyone
I had mx 3 weeks ago and went for results yesterday. Nurse said they were fantastic, no lymph node involvement and clear margins. She seemed very positive until I asked her about whether there were cells in my blood stream… She told me there was vascular invasion in the breast and didn’t elaborate.
I am now concerned that this is just as worrying as if there was lymph node spread. Can anyone enlighten me on what this actually means in terms of risk?
I am to have radiotherapy and hormone therapy but no chemo as I am post-menopausal. What if it has spread, how do they know it hasn’t if it is in my blood vessels. So confused. xxxxxxxx
just bumping this to the top for you
Vx
Hi
I got this answer off a medical site on internet if it helps you.
Before a cancer can spread to the rest of the body, it has to get into the channels that go through the rest of the body; that’s lymph channels or blood channels, particularly the venous system. If the cell gets into the veins, it can go to the heart, and the heart can pump those cells to the rest of the body; and it might grow in those places.
I dont actually know if i have vasculat invasion but i do know i have significant lymph node involvement. i have had chemo and will have rads and hormone.
The best thing you can do is ask at your next visit about it.
Hope this helps
Linda
I was told that I had PERIVACULAR invasion . can anyone tell me what that actually means? I should have asked but didn’t!
Thank you Linda, that is what I suspected it meant. However, am I correct in thinking that as blood flows through these affected vessels’ cells could be in my blood? I suppose they will have done bloodwork to rule it out.
I think perivascular invasion means there are cells around the vessels but not actually inside. Peri means “around”.
If anyone knows any more I would appreciate some info. I got the feeling the BCN avoided the question.
I was under the impression that vascular invasion was when the tumour starts trying to make it’s own blood supply,therefore making it possible for cells to travel via the circulary system and spread to distant parts of the body…but as you’ve been told it’s confined to the breast and you don’t need chemo I’d ask your breast nurse to clarify it. I had a lot of vas invasion when diagnosed over 5yrs ago. Thankfully I’m still ok. xx
Hi
I dont know about perivasulcar means but it might be something to do with lymph fluid as well. Although it is mentioned quite a lot on medical websites, its not actually explained although it does seem to be linked with lymph.
From what i have read, vascular invasion could mean that the cells have spread via heart. Any treatment offered would be looking at killing these cells. I read somewhere on here that chemo works best on younger women and those with node involvement so that might be why you havent been offered it. (i am making a big presumption here that you havent had an early menopause) Hormone therapy especially in strongly er/pr positive can be very effective.
There is an element of luck etc… i have been looking at this site and others for sometime. Whilst obviously statistics look at big picture, you also see a lot of people that buck trends both ways.
The American equivalent of this site has a lot more uptodate information and worth a look - breastcancer.org.
Its very difficult getting information and sometimes i feel frightened of what I might find out - walking a fine line between empowerment and despair… Hope this helps or someone who is a bit more knowledgeable than me comes along on here.
Linda
Linda
I’ve been reading too! Vascular invasion is one of the predictors along with presence of cancer cells in lymph nodes for example to determine probability of future spread. The research I looked at on the TRIP database of medical research found that patients with such invasion would benefit from chemo as it did signifcantly improve their longer term odds. From what I can see - the vascular bit - means that the tumour has generated its own vessels and that these have invaded the body’s existing vessels thus making it possible for spread. On that basis - I would certainly be asking my onc about chemo, and discussing risks and benefits etc.
Bright s
Thank you. I’m going to call BCN tomorrow. xx
Hi!
I’m no expert, but surely because you have had a mx - even if there were other cells in the breast - you’ve had the breast removed along with those cells. The chances of those cells having moved on before the mx must be very slight otherwise they would have recommended chemo.
Hi Redders
I understand what you are saying and it makes sense that the affected vessels have gone. I am worried that the cells that were there have travelled elsewhere already. Chemo seems to be only for younger women, or where there is lymph node involvement.
I have a large tender lump on my first rib. The nurse thinks it’s from the surgery, but I had it before. Had chest x-ray few months ago and came back normal. I JUST NEED TO KNOW WHAT I AM DEALING WITH!!!
There - I’ve shouted now…
Thanks for replying.
Hi
I had WLE and node removal 18mth ago nodes were clear but was told the lump was near the margin and they were unable to be sure if I had vascular invasion so I was offered chemo which I agreed to.
I was 50 then but think if I had been a little older it would not have offered,they said chemo was a precaution and I am so pleased I had it although not pleasant.
Although my op was different than yours I can fully understand what your concerns are I think the only person who can answer and help you is your Oncologist can you not make an appt to see him/her?
Hope this helps
Thank you - it does help. How are you now and are you on hormone treatment?
Hi Faith
Yes I am on Arimidex now Im told for 5 years and I am fine at the moment apart from the usual aches from the side effects of meds.
I go for a check up in 3 weeks with onc and will have 2nd mammogram around sept time.
I hope you are ok today
Best wishes
Jackie
Hi everyone - I spoke to my nurse who reassured me that there is no evidence of spread and the only time further tests would be performed would be if I presented with symptoms of metastases. I have only just got my appt with the radiotherapy specialist - 5 weeks after mastectomy and not till 8th August - wish it all wasn’t so slow-moving.
I am apparently going on to Amiridex (?) but no idea when or who will discuss this with me. Breast Nurse is on holiday.
I am also suffering alot of pain - like shooting pains - in my chest area and this area looks so hideous - it is puckered and concave and my ribcage is sticking out. Bit pissed off actually!!
Hi Faith,
Just read through this thread. Can’t add to the discussion as didn’t have vascular invasion but felt that you were (understandably) concerned about your symptoms and might benefit from a cyber hug ((())). If you have pain that lasts over 2 weeks then you should mention it and given your concerns over vascular invasion then I certainly would. BTW the only light I can shed on vascular invasion is that I was told by BCN and surgeon that my prognosis was good because I didn’t have any and only had micromets in my 1 lymph node so really had the best possible result (thereby presuming vascular invasion was NOT a good thing!).
Best of luck, xxx
Aww Thank you for the cyber hug - giving you a big one back. xxxxxx
Hi Faith - thats great news from your nurse you must be relieved.
I had to wait about 5-6 weeks before I saw the radiologist for marking up because my body needed to be stronger following chemo so perhaps they dont want to rush you as radiotherapy can make you tired.
I started Arimidex 4 weeks after chemo ended it was my Onc Consultant who discussed this with me gave me the script and told me when to start do you have an appt soon ?
Please ring the bcn on her return or the department as I am sure there must be someone else who can advise you.
You have been through enough without having added anxiety and I too want to send you Hugs and hope you get some answers soon.
Take Care
Jackie xx
hi faith
i didnt have vascular invasion but did have lymphatic invasion but clear nodes… so im guessing i was lucky that it was found before it had gotten further. which i think is the same as vascular invasion but just with blood vessels instead of lymphatic vessels… ie that was starting to spread but caught before it had done.
even people with neg nodes and no vacularlymphatic spread can can get mets… this is very unusual but can happen.
statistics mean nothing if you happen to be the 1 person in 1000 who gets what ever.
i think your BCN has given you good advice but if you want further clarification ask to see your consultant… write down all the questions you have so you dont forget anything important and he can give you facts and figures and hopefully reassure you some more.
hugs Lulu x
Just want to thank all of you who have posted - makes me want to cry. You are all so kind when you are going through your own crap!!
I am still not much clearer about who exactly my “onc” is!! I saw the surgeon at the first appt following diagnosis (which was at a different hospital where they carry out the routine screening). She went through the surgery procedure with me and that was it. Since then I have only had contact with Breast Care Nurse Team who told me what my treatment was going to be i.e Arimidex and rads, and I would get an appt with the rads doc soon. I have got this appt for next Friday. So who is my onc to whom I direct my concerns about the hormone therapy amongst other things? - seems that it all has to go through BCN which I understand and know that they are excellent, but I feel a bit patronised and guilty for asking stupid questions.
Oh I am so sorry for myself aren’t I - I will have to get a grip. Rambling, I know but just one more moan - my stepdaughter who is 30 and lives abroad has told my husband to stop dwelling on my cancer as it has gone now (mx)and when would I be going back to work? We are struggling financially and she obviously thinks I am lazy!!!
There are so many other issues in a person’s life that come to light when cancer strikes - the whole thing is so huge in terms of relationships and life in general - no-one gets it do they?
Hope everyone out there is feeling reasonably well today and thanks again. xxx