—Diet, Parabens & what the Oncologists don’t really discu
—Diet, Parabens & what the Oncologists don’t really discu —Hi, I was diagnosed with a Grade 1 Stage1 tumour at the end of Jan 2005, I had surgery and radiotherapy, and came through this without problems. I am on a 5 year course of Tamoxifen and I have monthly Zoladex injections (about 12 to go). I was reasonably calm about the whole thing (frightened, but calm), until I read Professor Jane Plant’s book “Your Life In Your Hands”. Her experience of breast cancer (diagnosed in 1988) viewed from a scientist’s standpoint was very interesting, but scary. Her argument is that diet has a significant part to play in this disease. She advocates more than anything else to cut out dairy completely and keep to a very low fat diet, high in organic fruit and vegetables. She maintains that Eastern Women have lower rate of Breast Cancer because they do not consume dairy products, and eat Soya. She refused to take Tamoxifen because of the side effects and having been diagnosed with less than 6 months to live in 1992 after changing her diet she is apparantly doing well. Having read her book I was so concerned about diet, having made no alterations to mine during my first year post treatment, I discussed it with my Oncologist who maintains that there is no scientific evidence that dairy products are related. I have however cut down my intake siginficantly. At the same time I came across some information about parabens (a preservative) used extensively in cosmetics that have been found in breast cancer tumours. I have subsequently stopped using anything that contains parabens (soaps, moisturisers, shampoos, foundation etc). Why are these scares and fears not discussed by the health professionals when you are going through treament? Why do you have to find some of these things out through your own research?
sirrah I think doctors are wary of recommending anything which has not been proved to work through properly conducted sdientific trials. Obviously if patients want to use alternative therapies, they are free to do so.
I am sceptical about Jane Plant’s theories, because what worked for her might not work for anyone else. Although she rejected Tamoxifen, she did have chemo, and maybe that’s what saved her. There are a number of vegans on this site, and you would think they would have been safe if JP is right. There ia also a great deal more stomach cancer in the Far East than there is here - so it’s swings and roundabouts.
As for parabens - this was a tiny study of 20 tumours and the tissue was not as far as I know compared with normal breast tissue, so that wasn’t very scientific. The whole population might have parabens in body tissue for all we know.
I’m not saying the conventional treatments are wonderful, just that you have to be a bit careful about media ‘scares’.
—diets —hi i think it best to eat what you like but in moderation . i do think that extra fruit and veg can only help though i bought myself a juicer so i can have a wider range of flavours its great everything is getting thrown in it now some are awful though but given me something else to do xx
They won’t discuss what’s not proven As far as I am aware the only scienfitic finding related to breast cancer survival and diet is that a very low fat diet cut recurrence by 42% in node-negative ER- women, but not demonstrate a clear benefit to ER+ women.
There are other speculations about diet and breast cancer, but nothing proven. The most likely bet seems to be not to gain weight or be overweight, especially if you’re ER-, whereas exercise may benefit ER+ women more. Still, even that needs testing.
As for dairy, a few studies have found that western women who consume more dairy actually have less breast cancer and are more likely to survive. Dairy consumption in the UK has declined 30% in the UK in recent decades, so it is definitely not a factor in any increase.
Read it again! I had a reoccurrence in Jan. luckily not in any vital organs, but in the lymph node, above the collar bone. I had suspected for about a year before that dairy products had a part in my diagnosis (personal opinion of course). I have been a veggie for nineteen years and leaned very much towards dairy because of this ( as did Linda Mac Cartney ) ( I am ER+) I did a lot of research on the internet and then came across the Jane Plant book ‘Your Life In Your Hands’ and without sounding too condescending, the answer is simply to, Read it Again. I did, and all your questions will be answered.
I have eliminated all dairy products from my diet. It’s tedious boring and time consuming, but I will learn to live with it. It’s a very small price to pay and having fought with my doctors for nearly two years to be given the right treatment for my type of cancer (which i got in the end) I no longer trust them and feel much more in control of this decease and feel I have a far better chance of living a longer life and maybe even, ( like Jane Plant) curing a reoccurrence that is supposedly incurable. My life is in My Hands and that’s the way I want it to be.
PaulaD
For anyone new to Jane Plant There have been many threads about Jane Plant’s theories, so I’m writing this mainly for people who have not heard of her before.
Plant’s book sounds very plausible and convincing and at a time when anyone diagnosed with breast acncer is feeling vulnerable her arguments can sound convincing. She has scientific credentials (as a geologist) and so sounds credible. In fact her ‘evidence’ is almost entirly anecdotal, and her description of her own cancer is not believable. For example, she claims to have been told taht she had 6 months to live…this after a local/regional recurrence which is not in itself terminal.
Sometimes people go into remission for long periods as Plant has…and this is great. But it has nothing to do with her diet. No one knows why some people stay in remission a long time and others don’t. Cancer is unpredictable.
‘Everyone makes their own choices’ but actually I think some of those choices should be challenged. I wish, how I wish that my life was in my hands and that there was something I could do to live longer or stop my cancer. But feel I owe it to myself and to the frinds who have died of cancer (some who did the diet and alternative stuiff and some who didn’t) to challenge the unsubstantiated nonsense about ‘helping ourselves’ which can be so frirgthening and undermining.
Yes I wish oncologists and other medics would say more about diet…if only to emphaise what is known scientifially and what is myth and speculation. Chrsitine MH has summed up well what is known about diet (but by the way the reserach was on node negative cancer so may not be relevant to anyone with node positive cancer.)
Jane
Becoming Vegan I became vegetarian almost 20 years ago in July 1986, I did consider going vegan then but decided I couldn’t give up the dairy products.
However, after my first chemo in January 2005 I heard about Jane Plant and bought her books - it certainly gave me food for thought! I then decided to become vegan, there are many more products on the market now to make it easier than there were 20 years ago. After the 6th chemo the lump had reduced to almost nothing and when I had a lumpectomy and my lymph nodes removed in June there was new tissue growth around the lump where it had reduced and the lymph nodes were completely clear from cancer as most, if not all, of them had been affected.
I don’t know how much the result stemmed from the vegan diet but I tend to think that at best it could be almost a cure in itself, at worst it won’t do anything but at least you would be more healthy and most people would fall somewhere in the middle. I have kept up with the diet as I want to try and make sure the cancer won’t return.
For the record, I’m both ER+ and PR+ and have been taking Tamoxifen with no apparent side effects since last July. I discovered in January that I’m also HER2+ and am waiting for NICE, and hopefully my Health Authority, to approve Herceptin sooner rather than later. I certainly believe that diet can help but would never think of refusing any treatment because of the change in diet.
— I saw my onc yesterday and when he asked me if i had any questions i bent down to my bag and he said " here is the list!" and laughed. I get a list out everytime and bombard him with so many questions i think he thinks i am nuts.Maybe i am .
One of the questions was about the phyto-oestrogen debate, so i asked if it was better for me not to eat food containing them. He said just to eat normally as not enough is known but they would recomend that no supplements with them are taken. So when i asked what the difference was he said just because in supplements they are more concentrated.I then asked about sauna’s and turkish baths (was going to visit spa while on my holiday) he said no cant have them for the rest of my life…
I said is it ok for me to swim as i will have only finished my rads by afew days when we go away, he said only swim for 20 mins per day till rad side effects (on skin) had gone.
I asked if it was ok for me to have a back massage and he said that was fine. So i can swim and have a massage - Tenerife sunshine here i come. Hehehehehe
There were afew more boring questions but wont go into them.
To Jeany —HI Jeany, I am curious why you are considering Hercepetin as you are now technically cancer free?
I had a lumpectomy (grade 3 tumour), chemo and radio (no lymph involvement) last year - and am ER and PR neg. and HER2 positive. My oncologist has said I do not need to take Herceptin. And this is not a budget issue, I have BUPA and they would pay for it!
I am curious why some ladies need it and some don’t, even after all their treatments and the fact that they now should be free of disease.
Anyone any ideas?
Sue
Saunas and Turkish Baths Pineapple,
Can you tell me why your onc said never to have sauna or Turkish bath? I can’t quite work out the rationale behind it.
TIA
Wynthorpe
— Hi, keeping in mind he is French but does speak good English he said (put on your best “Allo Allo” accent ! lol)" because you cant 'ave anything hot on your arm".
I didnt tell him that i have a hot bath every night , and i dont seem to have any problems. I do keep my arm out of the water though. Anyway thats what he said. Its a bummer as i was looking forward to my turkish bath next month! But at least he said it wasnt a problem to have a massage.
— —Hot bath every night- arm immersed- no lymphodoema ill effects. But heating on too low [green and economy] after op and during RT - house cold- modest lymphodoema resulted.
When it comes to dairy the CLA is very good for all of you and wonder if the IG-1factor is overemphasised as it’s a protein we need for healthy cell renewal. Supose the answer to that is moderation- not too much and not too little.
To SueBee Hi Sue,
When I saw my oncologist in January he said he thought that Herceptin would be beneficial for me as the risk of the cancer returning would be halved and has applied for funding.
However, I have seen the surgeon again today (following a very painful mammogram a week last Thursday, which is clear I’m relieved to say) and he said he didn’t see why I need Herceptin because the chemo had worked so well and there are the side effects of the drug to consider as well.
I’m now really confused! I think I’ll leave it until I see the oncologist again and see what further information he can give me as to the desirability of having Herceptin. It may be a case of seeing what NICE’s findings eventually are and weighing up the risk factor against the side effects.
I’ll do another posting when I know more.
Jean
Vegan I have been vegan for about 12 years but was diagnosed with breast cancer in Oct 2005. It was a 2cm grade 2, no lymph node involvement. Had radiotherapy, and currently on tamoxifen. I went through a period of being very angry at being told that a vegan diet would help me, as I had already been one for so long. I believe the issues are very complex and I believe that a number of factors contributed to my cancer; being on the pill so long, not having children yet (I am 38), alcohol consumption in the past…, and just good old rotten luck! And now there is a question mark over the negative impact of soya on breast cancer (as a vegan I consume a lot). Maybe the excessive soya was the problem…
For my own peace of mind I have decided that if I worry too much about it I’ll have a recurrence of cancer again through stress! I have read alot of books which, like you sirrah, scared me by suggesting that the cancer was in my hands, even that it was my fault I got it. I have learnt to take what advise I can from them about relaxing etc but I think we have to be careful about how much we think is our fault, and in our hands to change. Maybe this is the concern of the medical profession too, particulary with little strong evidence for some of the theories. I have a healthy vegan diet, exercise, try relaxing exrecises, filter my water and take care to use household products and cosmetics which have minimum harm. That gives me enough peace of mind that I am doing what I can.