Policies on anaesthetic needles/cannulas + blood tests following both total auxillary node clearance

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Hi ladies, hope you’re all doing well.

 

I’m having problems with regards to this issue about not having needles cannulas inserted in my arms, following total auxillary node clearance with both my mastectomies, 2006 and 2007. 

I had it repeatedly hammered into me by BCNs and consultants, due to the poss problems of infection and/or lymphoedema, NOT to have bloods taken, anaesthetic put into or even blood pressure cuffs on BOTH my arms.

When it came to my 1st recon op to install inflaters, 2013, I had the anaesthetic cannula placed in my inside ankle, tibial vein.
I have to constantly remember to tell nurses/ doctors NOT to take bloods from my arms. I’ve had needles inserted in the top of my foot for blood tests and with a recent minor knee op, the anaesthetic cannula was also put into the top of my foot.

 

I’m now having problems with the circulation in my right foot, following a radiographer recently trying to, and failing to successfully cannulate either of my feet, for a detailed CT scan contrast medium.

 

Has anyone else experienced all of this with following ops, blood tests?? Has anyone experienced any other options for where to insert needles?? As much as I DON’T wish to risk lymphoedema/infection - I’ve got such good, superficial and such EASY veins in my arms to access, and the prob with my foot/ankle is now a problem for my walking and walking boots.

 

Incidentally, I had a bad experience in an arm, lfollowing a dog bite, a couple of years ago. Had infection tracking up my arm within 20 mins, and had to go get immediate antibiotics at a walk-in clinic…

 

Thanks in advance of any of your responses.

Loadsa love

Delly xxxx

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Hi Delly. I’ve only had a left sided clearance and am due to start chemo on Friday. However I know my right side has naff veins and I have wondered about what they’ll do.
I have had cuts and nicks on my affected arm and have cleaned them straightaway with no problems. I would have thought in a controlled environment using aseptic technique the risks would be lessened especially with such good veins xx

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Hi Bottyboo - cute name!!

Taaa mucho for your reply lovey.

Yeh, I’m always very, very careful ref immediately treating ANY cuts, grazes, bites, avoiding sunburn etc., keep my arms covered when gardening to avoid scratches/breaks to my skin. AND yeh,  “Aseptic techniques” SHOULDN’T be a problem. BUT, and the BIG BUT is . . I’ve read and heard of women in the same position, having had medics carry out so called “aseptic techniques”, but who have developed lymphoedema from!! There’s a REASON why we have it bashed into us and are told to AVOID needles etc, even by the medical profession!!

 

I’m needing to know from other womens experiences of all this, and espesh from anyone on the Forum who may be MEDICAL themselves.

 

Lotsa love

Doolally xxxx

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P.S. Botty (awwww to your name again),

Please don’t refer to “only” having left clearance. Any flippin clearance is major - yeh??

I’m sooo sorry you’re having to have chemo, darlin girl. BUT, I DO hope all goes well with, as well as can be expected. That your side effects are as little as possible?? and you recover as quickly as possible. 

 

I don’t doubt you’ll receive great support from other chemo-cuties (as I call them) on here. Invaluable.

Good Luck flower

Loadsa love and a huge loooong hug

Doolally xxxx

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Oh Delly. I feel even dafter now because I have a medical background. Previous to having my eldest son I was a nurse. I had to give up when he was diagnosed with many problems and now he’s older work in a school to allow the school holidays. I was originally a one to one to a little girl with a brain tumour, nasogastric tube fed and all medicine down the tube. She was still undergoing chemotherapy and attended school most of the time even though she was in reception class and surrounded by bugs. She had the full backing of her team plus everything in place in school and at home. She is now in year 6 on remission and doing very well. When she moved to the next county I stayed and became keyword error for a little boy with double stomas. So although I no longer work for the NHS with my home and work life still have a little of involvement with medical issues.
I have had horrendous healing issues from my mammoplasty and am starting chemo still with an open wound, although now superficial. I understand how loose the term aseptic technique can be, in my career I’ve seen both ends of the spectrum and every stage in between. I guess I’m very lucky in that my node clearance has only caused me minimal altered sensation feelings which is just as well given the wound issues. I would never advocate using your arms if possible however you’re being affected by alternative venous access. Lymphodema is a risk at any time BUT you didn’t develop it after your dog bite. I know that’s no guarantee and I guess it’s whatever the risks of the particular situation you’re in versus the risk of problems. If I was in an emergency situation and my medical alert bracelet was missing there is every chance they would use my easier access left hand.
As much as you want to know other people’s experiences it doesn’t mean that would be your experience.
But if your legs/feet/mobility are being affected by using veins in various lower limb positions some other way needs to be looked at.
I don’t know how often you need venous access. If it’s fairly regularly have you considered a portacath? Much less obtrusive than a Hickman line or picc.
We are currently looking at one for my son’s venous access as his veins are completely inaccessible and he has to have yearly complete blood screening due to being on a ketogenic diet long term. The last 3 hospital admissions he’s ended up with central lines and for blood tests arterial stabs under ultrasound.
Hope this helps

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Sorry about the typos really must proof read. Should have read ‘still have a lot of hospital involvement’ not little doh!!

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Coo Bottyboo,

You sound to have a huge amount on your plate, with both your son and self. Keep kicking girl.

Thank you soooo much for your reply and taking the time.

I repeat my loving well wishes from my earlier message.

Loong hug

Dellypoos xxx

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Hi Delly. Finally managed to get to my first chemo today. Anyway, by total coincidence, when she asked which side my node clearance was on hubby said “what happens if someone’s had both sides cleared?”
She said they would put a Hickman in. However this would obviously be for chemo and we debated your issue (no names of course) and came to the conclusion it would have to be what you’ve already had done as a minor knee op wouldn’t warrant a hickman for obvious reasons.
The tibial vein makes more sense than the top of your foot for exactly the reasons you’ve had problems with. In an emergency there are obviously scalp veins particularly one in your forehead but again not ideal.
Sorry I couldn’t find a better answer. Hope someone else comes along with ideas.
Much love xx

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Hey Botty

Corr, thanks to you and hubby for that. That’s sooooo bloomin thoughtful of you both, much appreciated. So where is a Hickman usually inserted ?? Had to giggle at your mention of using SCALP veins - think a few needles in my head may possibly sort me and my current mental down head out, do me some good. Might try it - with some knitting needles me thinks - heehee.

It’s all come to the fore more recently, with me having had to have a whole shed load of tests, bloods, and scans, and the radiographer at the new to me local hospital being unable to access a foot vein for. Meant I had to be rebooked a few days later, my notes so called “red flagged” and the promise of a doctor/anaesthetist to carry out the cannulation. THAT didn’t happen and got worseat the next appointment - had a JUNIOR radiographer sitting in front of me, dying to attempt to stick a needle into the top of my foot !!!I Politely as possible, told her where to go, got dressed and stomped out. Haven’t got back to sorting it out tho’. Takes me ages to get round to ANYthing, even more so if I’ve had totally UNnecessary problems due to imcompetence or bad management. I also have it to consider for my two further recon procedures, when/if I get round to those !!

 

Sooooo that’s ONE treatment ticked off for you lovey - well done. I’m thinking, not having had chemo, but from what I’ve read from the chemo-cutie girls on here, it may take a few days for side effects to take a hold/kick in. Hope they aren’t too bad through it all and that you keep the physical and mental strength to cope. Sounds like you have a good supportive other half to help keep you kicking at this bleepty disease.

 

Where else are you posting on here??  It truely is a fantastic place for advice, help and support. Who better than from other fellow BC-ers

If I don’t see you again on here, I’m sure we’ll chat elsewhere. I plug into the “Just Diag and needing someone…” under Recently Diagnosed.

 

Loadsa love and a loooong Delly hug

xxxx