Rubbish veins...any tips!!

Hi
I am starting chemo on Friday and apparently my veins are rubbish!! When i went for my pre chemo checks the nurse really struggled to get a vein and am already bruised to bits , this has made me worried about getting a canula in, she suggested drinking lots before and said if all else failed they would give me a glass of wine to raise them!! I was feeling quite ok about the chemo till this and just wondered if any one else had rubbish veins and had any tips, many thanks, Sally

The nurses often make a right mess of both of my arms in their quest for blood. But one thing that usually works is they get a tall bucket thing and fill it with hot water and get me to put my arm in that for 10 minutes - brings the veins up beautifully.

Make sure you wear gloves, all the way to hospital and even in the waiting room pre-chemo to keep your hands warm.

I sympathise - I used to be OK about needles and used to give blood. Now I hate needles and the words ‘sharp scratch coming’ set my teeth on edge.

Best of luck with chemo. It’s not pleasant but it’s doable. And it goes quicker than you think. I’ve got through 4 already.

Pam x

Hi Salcha66
I do remember that my arm was warmed up beforehand either with a hot water bottle, heated blanket or in a bucket of hot water and this helped to make my veins appear. Did anybody suggest this? If not maybe give it a go.
Hope all goes ok for you Friday and that they don’t bruise you any more.
Hugs
Ruby x

Thanks Pam and Ruby, i only have the one arm they can use because they wont use my right arm as i had 13 lymph nodes removed. She did say they would try to warm it up but thinks my veins are deep and thats why they cant find them. I too have never been bothered about needles but after mondays episode and the mess my arm is in now am dreading them coming anyway near me! Am thinking i will just miss the water bit and go straight to the wine…!!! Just joking! Will try the gloves thing and trust that they find my elusive veins!! Sally x

Hi I had trouble with my veins but only for last two chemo’s and had to put my arm in a sink of warm water for a while before chemo.For the last one they used a vein in my hand.You could ask for a PICC line this is inserted in the arm (i think) and it stays in place throughout chemo so no trying to find veins.I know there are lots of women on here who have had this,hope they come along soon to help

Best wishes Melxx

I’m the same - rubbish veins - don’t you just hate it when they start prodding and saying, ‘oo your veins aren’t great are they!’

Agree with keeping your arm warm beforehand. The chemo nurse also told me that it helps if you have plenty to drink and keep well hydrated. I have done this for the past couple of chemo sessions and blood tests and it has worked. Worth a try anyway!

Rachelx

Thanks for your advice Mel, they ended up having to use a vein in my hand to get blood then to add insult to injury she said ’ oh you dont like to part with your blood do you! ’

Rachel, i too hate that when they get that determined but frustrated look on their face as they prod about, then when they say i will give this one a try only to be told a few seconds later, ‘no nothing there’ and then leave me with yet another bruise!

Hopefully my veins will miracoulously appear on Friday and it will all go well!

Thanks for all the tips much appreciated

i had really bad veins with the fec too. (finished my chemo Feb last year). I always used to soak my arm in warm water before the chemo, too.

will be thinking of you for Fri.
eva

I had a portacath fitted under general anaesthetic. It sits under the skin just above my reconstructed breast (where I have a recurrence) and is invisible apart from a raised bump the size of a 10p piece.

The reason for it, was that my first chemo took twice the length of time it should have done and also left me with hardened veins, so as I can only use one arm too (due to reconstruction) there wasn’t much chance of me getting through 6 chemos + Herceptin.

It is such a relief not to have to go through the prodding etc, so do ask about it. The chemo goes in via a special needle that pierces the tube through the skin. Some of the ‘lines’ that get put is stay on the surface (so you can see a tube and it is very easy to fit the syringe onto it), but mine is embedded, which suits me better.

Annie

Hi Sally

My first chemo didn’t start too well. They couldn’t find a vein in my left hand so had to use the right hand which was the arm they weren’t supposed to use because of the surgery!

On the second chemo the nurse gave me a small heat pack to warm up the back of my hand and this worked a treat - they were then able to use the left hand.

However, I then had 4 more chemo’s to get through and then 18 herceptin so I carried on using the heat pack, which worked.

There was one occasion when I did have a different nurse and when I asked for the heat pack she said I didn’t need one and wouldn’t listen to my protests. Needless to say, after several attempts by her and then 3 other nurses, my arm was badly bruised and swelled up. After that I asked for the same nurse every time who I knew would always find a vein and she did!

Good luck with your treatment. Love xxx

Hi Salcha, I’ve never had problems with blood tests and the like, but three different chemo nurses advised a PICC line because like you I’ve lost the lymph nodes on the operation side and they thought I might suffer vein damage from the treatment. I had the first without it, though, and my arms were warmed with hot pads first. I also drank until I was having to go to the loo all the time while I was waiting. (This is a good idea anyhow, as it helps to flush the chemicals through your system as soon as possible.) If you have a rough time, ask about having an intravenous device like a PICC. This makes the blood tests and treatments easier on you and the nurses. I won’t deny that I find the thing a bit of a nuisance, but it might be the best solution.

Cheryl

Thanks so much to everyone who has posted, makes me feel a lot better that its not just my veins being ‘awkward’ ! I just feel its bad enough having to go through chemo without my bloomin’ veins playing ball!! Have written all your advice down and will take it with me on Friday and if we have a struggle then i can talk about the options you have suggested with my chemo nurse. Was feeling quite ok about the chemo till a few hours ago when i realised i only had 'two more sleeps ’ to go till chemo day! My chemo nurse said i had to think of chemo as ‘my friend’, i keep thinking with friends like that who needs enemies!!

Good wishes to you all and once again thanks for the advice i really really appreciate all the posts, Sallyx

Sally - PICC line. You may not be in time to get one put in before your first chemo - but do ask about it for the following ones. It’s a pretty straightforward procedure, done under a local anaesthetic with ultrasound guidance. I’ve had mine in since the beginning, basically my veins duck for cover when they see a white coat, and like you, having had anc, I only have one arm to use safely. Also the ‘E’ in FEC can play havoc with your veins - so my reasoning was even if the line only stayed in long enough to get through three FEC, then it was worthwhile.

Showering is a pain, but I use a limbo arm cover, which keeps the dressing dry. Definitely ask about it - and good luck xxx

Blimey Salcha66 am struggling with your chemo nurse comment on ‘think chemo as your friend’! She must have some difficult friendship relationships in her life!

It isn’t pleasant but you will get through it (I’m half way through mine) and I’ve had good days and bad days, but time is passing and I can see light at the end of the tunnel. I think chemo as being absolutely necessary and am lucky to be able to have access to it. Someone posted recently ‘it’s a short year in a long life’ and I keep remembering that!

Good luck. Keep us posted

Rachelx

Hi Sally and others

re the heat packs

I have also had trouble in that some nurses will give you a heat pack for problem veins and others don’t. I now take my own, in fact I leave one in my handbag. I bought a couple of those gel-filled sachets, there is a metal disc inside, when you bend the disc it activates the liquid to solidify and warm it up and they are reusuable. They are designed for walkers and I bought mine in Blacks. They don’t get very hot, but they are warm enough to really raise up your veins. Since using them, they have got the cannula in first time each visit. I would definately recommend these and drinking lots of water too!

Hi Sally my veins are rubbish too always have been. The moment chemo was mentioned my response was, “I want a line” had a hickman inserted week before FEC 1. It was inserted under local and I was all done within the hour. The line comes out on my chest wall a couple of inches below my collar bone. It has a clear dressing which survives showering well, the line tucks neatly into my bra behind the wobbly ( prosthesis) and not detectable to others.
I believe hickman’s aren’t great if you have small children or pets who might tug on it, ( ports better under those circs) I love mine, the thought of the regular stabbing and poking along with those staff whose confidence exceeds their competence and the bruises would have pushed me right over the edge.
Pat

Hi Sally,

I have had 3 FECs so far, the first they heated my hand to get the vein up and it went OK. Unfortunately the ‘E’ makes your veins worse, so my second session wasn’t quite as easy (3 attempts to get a vein) so the nurse suggested a PICC. I managed to get an appointment before FEC 3, but unfortunately it got infected, so was removed and I had a course of anti-biotics. My 3rd FEC got delayed and then it took ages to get a needle in.

I was then told I could go for another PICC, or a port, but as I am not having herceptin after chemo I thought a port wasn’t worth it just for 3 sessions. So I am having the new PICC put in tomorrow.

The procedure is really easy and quick, with only local anaesthetic. You do need to get it flushed every week though, which depending on your area can mean a trip to the chemo dept every week. It comes out really easily when they take it out (similar to a drain, but smaller tube)

The port is good if you are having herceptin, as the treatment is longer. but the insertion and removal have to be done under general anaesthetic.

Ask the nurses in the chemo department as they deal with the different types all the time.

There is also a PICC or not to PICC discussion on here which might be useful for you.

breastcancercare.org.uk/forum/to-picc-or-not-to-picc–opinions–t28818s75.html

Hi Sally

I had my chemo getting on for 3 years ago. I had the PICC inserted on the same day as my first FEC, and it was wonderful, I cannot praise them enough for mine. Although it meant a weekly trip for line cleaning, I actually felt comforted by this, like I was being kept an eye on throughout the chemo cycle.

18 months later I had i/v antibiotics for cellulitis, and it took 11 stabs in ar, hand and foot before they got a canula in, and even then it only lasted a day, so I had another PICC put in. If I need this again, I’ll ask for the PICC straightaway.

Good luck with chemo, and remember there’s plenty of support on here.

Kinden

Hi Sally
On my first chemo it took the nurse 8 attempts to get the canular in. A week later i got fleabitus in the arm and had to go to Christies (cancer hospital in Manchester) ther sugested a Hickman line and I had it put in a week later. The Hickman line is similar to a Picc but it goes in through your neck and comes out on your chest. The proceedure is done under a local annestetic. Mine has been brill and i am on my last FEC chemo tomoz have not had to worry about any needles even for blood tests as everything goes through the line.
Will be thinking of you Good luck and take all support offered

Sorry about the spelling not my strong point

Shirley

I grew to love my PICC line, despite hating it initially as once it was in place I could never put the treatment to the back of my mind as it was a constant reminder (for some reason the lack of all hair didn’t bother me even a tiny fraction as much!). I resisted until after the second lot of chemo when it took 7 attempts to get the canula in and the lovely nurse hit a nerve. Things were so much easier after it was in place.

Jacqui