Smile! You've got cancer

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I have to say, I had no idea about all this ‘positive thinking’ backlash until I got BC! So there is something new learned…

I haven’t had anyone tell me I have been given a gift or that I’ll come out of the end of it better off in any way. We all just hope I come out of the end of it. And am able to have a similar life to the one I had before. I am still hopeful (positive, optimistic) of this.

Things will have changed, but not irretrievably, I hope.

I think the miscommunication happens when one person’s positive thinking is about getting on with life as best we possibly can while going through this - these people are not in denial or thinking they have been ‘blessed’ by cancer! And another person’s positive thinking is about pretending they are OK, whether to save the feelings of their family or friends, or to themselves. They are worlds apart.

But I would be surprised to meet anyone who isn’t thoroughly pissed off about having cancer and would willingly hand back the unwanted gift!!

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Hello again,

Truffle, you need a good bottle of tequila to go with that stylish lime on the cat’s head!

I agree with the thought that “positive thinking” means different things to different people. I know some people get very annoyed when it’s mentioned. Maybe a new way of expressing this could be found to cover the “getting on with life in the best way possible” and the “I can cancel it out if I’m positive enough” ways of thinking.

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I find head in the sand a refreshing approach. Cancer- me? noooooo

Doesnt always work!

S

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Hi everyone. Just wanted to say to bad fairy in particular how much your comments resonated with me. Just like you, I was diagnosed in July 2009 with primary bc and secondary bone mets I am 50 and my daughter is 18. I am lucky I suppose to have had 10 more disease free years than you have been granted but its still not enough. no-one should have their life curtailed like this. I have been through the whole range of emotions but like you I decided quite early on that I would rather spend whatever time I have left getting on with it. I could wail and moan and beleive me I have done a bit of that when I cant resist the feeling sorry for myself moments but I would rather spend my days in laughter and love because as you so rightly say whatever I do I cant change the outcome.

I must admit my pet hate is how people go on about fighting and battling cancer like its only people who simply werent strong enough who die from it. What a load of tosh

Julie

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Hi all,
I read the article too and really related to it. The line in particular that I liked was how people insist on looking at the glass half full when in fact it is already smashed on the floor. I too don’t think of myself as ‘brave, strong, inspirational’. I am just doing the best I can to make the most of what is left of what was a fantastic life, while I still can. I suppose the ONLY good thing that has come out of this dreadful disease is that I appreciate just how good my life was.
Louise

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Well when I wake up tomorrow with my positive attitude I will remember to remind myself I should actually be depressed and when I see a breast awareness pink bunny I shall rip off its ears and tell it to wear something far more dull to stop it bringing “public awareness” and when someone tells me I am being brave and still cracking jokes and holding them because they are in tears not me I shall remember to tell them to come back to me when they have learnt how to react properly, whatever that is and when I have learnt to be angry, oh hang on a minute, I am angry, I will cash in on it and write a book.

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I think all of us have a positive attitude to this situation we find ourselves in to some extent and we all want to get better. The main think that annoys me intensely it the way other people react and tell me that I am brave and strong as if this will protect me from a bad outcome - hey I have news for them, - IT WONT!

People say and do these things to help make themselves feel better about the situation, not because they really believe that we have been given a gift - it is something they can actually do to try and help the situation, but I wish sometimes they would stop and try and feel how it would be if it happened to them, and how they would feel to be told how much better life will be after they are ‘well’ and have the ‘all clear’, all misconceptions given to them by the so called awareness campaigns.

Yes I like the pink fluffy stuff, it does not offend me in the slightest, and I do have a positive attitude 90% of the time, when I am not being poisoned or burnt by my ‘gift’, but I would also love to see some reality too, there are times I could smash everything in the house and feel so sorry for myself I cant stop crying - if we never let others become aware of how scary and debilitating this gift can be how can we expect them to stop being pink and fluffy on our behalf??

I still think that the article was excellent and well thought out, but does this have to make me a negative pink bashing person at the same time? Can we not just appreciate both sides and meet somewhere in the middle where most peoples reality lies?

Dena

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Hi all, I haven’t read the article yet (really should get out of bed), but your comments are all so true, even though they are cover such a wide spectrum!

I’m predominantly a ‘positive’ person. The cup is always half full, and I believe that is why my life pre breast cancer diagnosis in June 09, was so comfortable. I’d achieved a lovely work / life balanece and am determined to get back to that (or similar). Therefore, in order to get through the nightmare that is breast cancer treatment I’m not being brave, inspiring or heroic, I’m not in denial, I’m just being me.

Early on in my treatment a friend posted a quote on facebook “self belief is a little magic that comes from within” and I have called on this during the times I needed a cry and a rant and was feeling totally peeved with the whole thing, but it has really helped. Of course it wont change what my destiny is, but it helped get me through ‘now’, and that is as much as anyone can do. How can you worry about something which may or may not be, you’d go mad, wouldn’t you?

I certainly don’t see cancer as a gift, yet at the same time it has been oddly liberating. I’ve met some wonderful people, I’ve ended up (and quite like) the baldy look, and have a whole host of expereinces I would like to pass on to others that join our devastating world; and I’ve learned so much about the people who really matter in my life. I’ve hated the impact my diagnosis has had on my family, and would’ve done anything to protect them from the misery and worry it has caused them.

Like many of you I started this journey as a fit, non smoking, non drinking, gym going, well fed, contended little flea, and if one more person wishes me a healthy new year, I’m gonna pop them on the nose. I was healthy when I got into this, and it is the treatment that is making me ill, not the condition! And, as for the pink, fluffy stuff…hmmmm bit undecided but if it brings in the funding for amazing things like this web site, they can get as pink and fluffy as they like.

Really should read the article instead of spouting about something I am in ignornace of…back later with my thoughts

Loo x

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hi loo, i can agree with you saying that having breast cancer has been liberating as i can honestly say it has changed my hope perception and out look on life, i had wle and snd begining dec and due to start rads this thursday so compared to a lot of the ladies on this site i know ive got off(so to speak)relatively easily in terms of not needing chemo and nodes being clear. i am using my time off work to contemplate just about everything and to change a lot of things that were ‘wrong’ in my life for example when i was working full time i was quite tired when i got home and that made me a little snappy with the kids whereas now im stopping myself from jibbing at them for trivial things and im finding myself chatting to them more, i know thats partly because i now have a lot more time but i do intend to carry it on.
sue

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Barbara Ehrenreich has just been on BBC Radio 4’s “Start the Week”, talking about her book and her experiences of being told to “be positive” when she was being treated for BC. You might be able to hear it on the BBC website’s “Listen again” facility.
M xx

BTW, having BC has definitely NOT been “liberating” or any other positive result for those of us with secondaries, who have died in our thousands each year, and are dying now of this dreadful disease.

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I have read the article now, but remain open minded. It is one woman’s experience of Cancer; and I am quite able to keep her thoughts on her experience separate from how I have experienced cancer. She does raise some interesting issues, ones that I have also encountered on my journey, however, I think your BTW epitomises the problem with macro level discussions and generalisations on such subjects. The experiences of individuals are so intensely personal, and yet it is apparent, there seems to be a degree of expectation to ‘fit’ the cancer model – whatever that might be.

We can only write about our own experiences and opinions, but we’re all on shifting sands because of diagnosis, prognosis, response to therapy, psychological state, environment etc. No two of us are the same therefore, it seems wrong to even consider the possibility that there should be any parity in our opinions and experiences.

I will have a listen to her interview, so thanks for bringing it to the thread.

Loo

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From this I think I learn that there are two understandings of ‘positivity’ - a right one and a wrong one - and many people have the wrong one, and that is what Barb Ehrenreich I think is aiming at in her article. Wrong to think that mental attitude has one jot of an effect on disease process, as though by taking thought you could change the outcome, the progress, of your disease, etc. Wrong because it is unrealistic, that is to say, out of line with the truth, with reality, with the way things really are. This is ‘be positive, live in cloud cuckoo land where thinking it’s fine can make it fine.’

Perfectly legitimate, though, as bad fairy says (and others I think), to make the very best of what you have. That is realistic. That is saying: yes, I know exactly what’s going on, and I’m not going to waste my precious time on things I can’t change: I am going to be happy in spite of it, as far as humanly possible, and I am going to do all the good things I can manage to do.

sno

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Came across this old thread by accident, and thought it was so interesting I would resurrect it.
When I was first diagnosed with secondary BC, I remember starting a thread to the effect that there is nothing wrong with pink. At the time I felt all the pink twaddle was a harmless way of raising funds and the profile of BC, but I now take a very different view. My view now is that the pink razz actually incorporates a very harmful philosophy that serves to reduce BC in the public consciousness, divert attention from the political and economic issues that stand in the way of a cure, and pacify cancer patients so that they do not kick up a stink.
It’s interesting that in the Guardian article, Ehrenreich writes about the way the positive thinking clap trap has worked against other groups in the US, such as the unemployed. Unemployed people are told their negative attitude is the problem (rather than lack of jobs), and this shifts responsibility from Government, encourages complacency within society, and maintains the status quo. This is where I think we are with BC. While cancer patients are encouraged to ponder our navels, and BC charities encouraged to maintain the status quo (encouraged by their receipt of government funding and stakeholder membership of organisations such as NICE), there is no pressure for change.
It seems to me the worst aspect of positive thinking is the apathy that arises from it. I firmly believe the reason we don’t have a cure, is not only because not enough money is thrown at research, but because the people throwing money have profit as their main consideration - and they want a single cure all magic pill, and what’s more, they want it quickly. Perhaps if we (society), all jumped up and down, that would change?. Meanwhile, the only hope of a cure (in my view), comes from places like China, where they are prepared to throw money, and keep throwing it. Interestingly, I note that all the rights to the work of the Nobel Prize winning scientist who discovered that cancer goes through a stage of angiogenesis (which led to the creation of Avastin), was sold to China recently. Maybe they appreciate that the scientist was onto something, and unlike pharmaceutical companies in the west are prepared to persevere.

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Have read many of these messages and found them really refreshing! I am just starting on my journey and trying to come to terms with it all. I can’t bear the pink fluffy appraoch either, nor the fussing friends who will tell me I’m being positive and brave. I have not told many peolpe yet, until I know what I am really facing I have felt that best. Those I have chosen to tell are all so supportive and kind. How did others cope with fussy friends?
We have no choice - we just have to get on with it! However, I feel we are the same people inside and we must hang on to that.
Am trying to keep cheerful - the answer for me now, before my main surgery, is just to keep busy. Not sure how I’ll be afterwards, but hope I’ll cope alright. Worried I shall get emotionally down and lose confidence too. Just don’t want the news to be any worse than it has been so far - this month has been like the Cresta run - downhill all the way! Feel it will be a long haul back up the mountain! Thank goodness for a great hospital team - I couldn’t ask for more, especially smiles! They are wonderful!
If anyone else is going through it right now I’d love to chat with you.
Seagull

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Seagull you sound as though you feel that the fact your firiends congratulate you for being positive/brave, that your real feelings of being upset /frightened/unhappy is somehow wrong, or failing to meet up to the standards being set for you. Your feelings are not wrong and frankly, you wouldn’t be human if you were happy and cheerful under the circumstances. For me, the main thing wrong with those who suggest that positivity can influence outcome is that the message contains a subtext - which is that if you are not positive, you alone are responsble if things do not go well (and of course when individuals accept sole responsibility, it prevents them from taking action that would have a positive effect - like demanding decent treatment).

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Thing is, the “be positive/strong/brave” message denies the existence of the fear and other so-called ‘negative’ emotions. I feel that in order to be able to deal with what we have to deal with, we need to acknowledge the fear and sadness and all the other unfashionable feelings that we ALL feel, and then get on with what we have to do. If we just shut our eyes to the scary stuff, or feel guilty that we’re not really being as positive as everyone tells us to be, things will be SOOO much more difficult to handle.

So go ahead, feel scared, feel sad, cry, rant, scream - and then get on with doing what you have to do to get through this. Sod the pink!

Good luck, Seagull

CM
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