the NHS

Public Archive
41

I don’t for a minute believe that the NHS will be safe under the Tories, and am incensed that front line services will suffer because of an economic system that is fundamentally wrong. I was a senior nurse before forced to take early retirement, and know that the NHS is far from perfect, but also that it has improved in many areas.

I am also glad that we have a welfare system that takes care of the most vulnerable people in society-people forced to use it ( including me) are not all work shy layabouts.Reforms are needed, but surely a society is judged fundamentally on how it cares for it’s sick and unemployed? Cameron’s 'big society", seems to be about getting rid of front line services and depending on willing ( unqualified) volunteers.

nicky

42

I would just like to see more consistency across the board. Until & unless we in Scotland achieve independence, we are all paying our taxes & NATIONAL insurance for a NATIONAL health service (at least those of us who’re working are, cherub, I take your point, not everyone is contributing.) Nevertheless, we are not all treated the same. In England, cancer patients get free prescriptions, we in Scotland do not. We do, however, get our wigs free, for which I am very grateful, but I believe in England that’s not the case. Correct me if I’m wrong (I’m sure someone will). It doesn’t seem so long ago that there was all the publicity about Herceptin being available to some but not others ( the postcode lottery ), but when I mentioned this to my nurses they told me that was only in England, in Scotland it’s always been available. These are only 3 examples, there must be loads more, & as for the situations in Wales/N.Ireland, I have no idea. Surely the very term NATIONAL implies consistency across the board ?
I would also like to see any party looking at services in a more imaginative way. While I am not opposed to any form of means testing, after all it’s obvious there’s not a bottomless pit of resources, it seems hard to me that those of us who work & pay our taxes for years end up having to fight our way through such a complicated benefits system at a time when we are physically ill, & emotionally fragile. Why, for example, should there be a time limit on SSP ? There’s no time limit on the illness. After SSP ran out, I had to go on ESA, at which point I was told that because I rent privately & there is a cap on housing benefit, my rent would not be fully covered, & there was a shortfall of £17 per week approx, leaving me with about £47 per week to live on. This will barely cover the basics, no chance of any wee treats to make me feel better.Apparently if I lived in a council house the rent would be paid in full. Yet, I had to provide a copy of my lease when applying, so my rent amount was provable. I don’t think that’s fair at all. We are all aware that many people in this country are unemployed, most through no fault of their own, but it cannot be denied that there is a proportion who have not worked & don’t intend to, who never have to worry about paying their rent. How many of us are forced to return to work before we are ready, because we cannot afford to be sick any longer. So, having made my contributions, I would like to see SSP payable for as long as illness lasts, & housing costs fully funded by housing benefit.
I agree that it is important how we, as a society, look after our needy, but it seems to me that somehere between the well off, who do not reqire assostance, & the badly off who require assistance with everything, & pay for nothing, there are those of us who pay for everything, & then are penalised for it. You only have to look at the savings thresholds. If we work, pay tax, & still manage to save a bit, our benefits are reduced. If we don’t, we get full benefits. Again, how is that fair ?

43

Divvy, I believe Herceptin only became available for early stage breast cancer in Scotland round about the time I was diagnosed, October 2006. I was told after my first chemo in the November that I was Her2+ and the oncologist said to us she was now pleased to be able to offer Herceptin on the NHS as she couldn’t have done this before.(I think like other places it was being offered only to women with advanced cancers - I have a relative who is an oncology Professor and told me up till it was approved you had to have at least 10 lymph nodes or more affected to get it). We had savings at that point as we had sold our house in Essex to move up here 2 years previously. Had it not been available we had already decided we would have to use that money to pay for it. The doctors treating me also said that one of the problems in England is that many of the health boards are huge compared to up here in Scotland.

44

Well said Divvy1, totally agree with you. the benifit system as it stands today is very unfair, and in my view Cancer is percieved as less important by the current system than my neighbour with a bad back who has been living on benifits for years.
There is a postcode lottery in this country regarding treatments/care and i also agree there is a stark contrast with different illnesses.
My DX and cancer care was exelent, i cannot fault it at all and have nothing but praise for the NHS for MY treatment.
However, wind back 12 mths when my father aged 76 woke in the night with severe head pain and fell to the bathroon floor,he crawled back to bed on his knees as he had only one leg after an amputation 2 years previous, his GP was called and he “couldnt” decide whether or not my father had had a stroke , even though his speech was slurred, infact he asked my mother “what she thought” he eventually decided to call an non urgent ambulance that took 4 hrs to arrive, My father then waited 5hrs in A&E waiting to get admitted to a ward, when he was eventually found a bed , a nurse gave him a glass of water, which he choaked on ( a drink is not something you give a suspected stroke patient)his swallowing was parcially paralised this was why he choaked,water went into his lungs and because of this he contracted phenomia, and 2 weeks later he died.
The stroke unit and the care he recieved was appalling (This was the same hospital that treated me by the way) my father was left with a sucking tube to use by himself and a bowl of water to dip it in to supposidly clean it,he couldnt get out of bed as was partly paralised down one side and as such often wet himself as nurses were so slow at answering the call buttons ,The tube continualy kept falling on the floor collecting germs and was never replaced or cleaned by the staff in the 2 weeks he was there, he was left to clear constant mucas from his throat by his self, on one occasion i was there my father was choaking as his chest was now so bad and he was turning blue , there was a nurse at the opposite bed who i called out to for some help here please and she sauntered slowly over and just put his bed upright and went back to what she was doing. My fathers care from begining to the end was appalling ,my father was a proud man and his final days was undignified and uncaring , i get so very upset when i think off his care from the NHS .
As others have said this is a national health service , care /treatments should be equaly good for all illnesses , as it stands in my expierence this is definately not the case , a hell of a lot depends on your postcode and the illness you have , not acceptable.
Linda

45

Cherub

Sorry for the innacuracy re Herceptin & Scotland, was just repeating what nurses said, & at the time of all the publicity I will admit to not having paid a lot of attention.
Re the huge health boards in England, compared with Scotland, well, that’s my point exactly. Where does the NATIONAL come in ?

46

The inconsistencies in health care in the 4 nations certainly exist and England has streaked ahead of the devolved countries in some areas - notably waiting times.

But this is a devolution issue - health responsibilities, policy and priorities were devolved to the relevant national governing bodies.
Scottish health issues are the responsibility of Holyrood - not Westminster.

It all depends what the health focus of each nation was - in England it was about improving waiting times etc. Scotland opted to spend their money on providing free social care (which is only available on a very strict means-tested basis in England.)
Because Scotland has so many social health issues the Scots get much more money per head than the English - £2,313 in Scotland, £1,915 in England.

Great things have been achieved in Scotland though - remember what Michael Gray and Tina McGeever achieved by petitioning MSPs after their local NHS trust at Grampian refused to pay for his cancer drug.

It is swings and roundabouts for us all since devolution - all English students are faced with collosal debt from university tuition fees which of course Scottish students studying in Scotland don’t have to deal with.

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lindiloo, I am really sad to read of your father’s treatment. My late dad had dementia and I looked after him for a year when he was in the early to middle stages (one of the reasons I had to move back from London). I could not even get a house call from a GP and if I rang up I was just told I had to take him to the surgery. There is a GP at my surgery who appears to loathe his job to the point he never makes eye contact and is very rude. I actually said to this GP “what don’t you understand about the fact my father is over 85?” Treating the elderly in such a poor fashion is appalling, it’s like they are written off for being old.

Dad was actually taken into care after an incident where he was in hospital having a minor procedure. He wandered off and was found streets away by the police trying to find his way home. The GP surgery were more than happy for the hospital to take over as it meant they didn’t have to handle anything!

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My MIL died of ovarian cancer 12 years ago. She was put off and ignored to the point that she finally got her diagnosis 2 days before she died. When she was admitted to hospital, the week she died, family asked if she could have a bath as she had been doubly incontinent and was very confused and distressed, and were pointed in the direction of the bathroom. Her care was appalling.
My mum died of pneumonia in the same hospital 3 years ago. We were so well supported that she had a beautiful death, she was clean, fresh, comfortable and we had her last hours with her, with staff just popping by to see if they could bring fresh tea/meals (for us) and to make sure mum was still comfortable. They followed the ‘Liverpool pathway’ for end of life care.
The improvements I have seen since the change of government in 1997 are massive. I know how much time money and energy has been put into improving standards for older people and protecting vulnerable people, because that is one of my responsibilities, (in the community, rather than hosp care - but people are generally happier to be cared for at home whenever possible).
We are at huge risk of watching the NHS being dismantled and undermined if a Tory government get into power. They don’t need the NHS, we do.

49

I have seen health care at both ends of this country under both the Tories and Labour. When we lived in London we had BUPA cover for 20 years via our employers and if I was still in London I would still have insurance. A friend of my former neighbour was diagnosed at the same time as me and was at the very upper end of the scale for waiting times all the way through on the NHS in E London/Essex.

50

I agree with you Daisyleaf x

51

When I had my first breast lump in 1996 Major was in office and we were dealing with the legacy of years of Tory underfunding.
I had to wait 3 weeks just to see my GP and the referral time to the breast cancer specialist was 3 months. I had the lumpectomy under local anaesthetic whilst still awake in order to cut down on waiting time for a bed. It was truly horrendous.
I had no follow up treatment whatsoever. They basically cut it out and lobbed me back on the street 2 hours later. I had to wait 6 weeks to find out if it was cancer or not.

This time around I was diagnosed and had started treatment within 2 and a half weeks of finding the lump. I was given my diagnosis within an hour of the biopsy at a one stop breast clinic. I have had exemplary treatment and support.
What a turn around in just over a decade. And now it looks like we are going to see all of this good work undone.
I despair for this country. People really don’t know when they are well off.

52

It’s the same in other countries, not just the UK. I have a relative who is an oncologist. Back in the 90s he went to Australia to head up a clinic there because he was fed up of some of the reforms here. When he got to Australia he said he found it was pretty much the same thing!

I don’t think it matters who wins the election next week, Gordon Brown started wrecking the economy when he sold off the gold reserves and his mismanagement of everything thing else will mean there might not be any more money in the pot for the NHS (certainly not if we keep getting health tourists for sure). If the Tories get re-elected we will be going back in time to 1979 on account of them having to sort out Labour’s mess again (I worked in local government at the time of the Winter of Discontent and it was truly appalling,I won’t talk about some of the dodgy practices that went on). The Governor of the Bank of England apparently told an eminent US economist (off the record) this week that whoever gets power next week will probably go out of office and be unelectable for a generation because the depth of the financial crisis in this country that has to be sorted out is so great. Not exactly something to be proud off, I do not know how the current PM and his Cabinet Ministers can sleep at night. As for wheeling out Teflon Tony and Cherie to campaign, give me a break.

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I couldn’t agree more msmolly

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personally i am pleased Gordon Brown has been the PM during this financial crisis… hes an economist and is aware of the long term consequences and not just looking at the short term fix… i would hate to think how some of the others would have handled it…

just because another party slags him off doesnt actually mean they would have done things any better.

55

I think alot of us can remember who wrecked this country and destroyed thousands of peoples livelihoods. Thatcher!! I’m sure she sleeps well at night…

56

This NHS failed my Father , he died in 2006 under this government, had he been admitted to hospital earlier by his incompetent GP, he may have still been alive today,the faster the treatment for a stroke patient the more of the person you can save , as i said from start to finish his care was discusting ,i too believe that often the older generation are not taken care of so well . When my fathers leg was amputated 2 years before he died , there was other options that could have been preformed to save his leg but he was told because of his age the cost was high ,so effectively it was cheaper to cut it off , how cruel.
I am realy sorry cherub to hear that your fathers care and treatment was so absolutely appalling also ,there was a story in the papers this week of elderly lady named Clara Stokes who was awarded by Gordon Brown for being in the land army ,who died after she was left to wallow in her own filth on an NHS ward. She had had a stroke also, so lets not paint Labours NHS as so perfect because it is still failing a lot of people today.
We need Less managers, more frontline staff, nurses/doctors, and bring back the Matrons.

57

Always makes me laugh that in spite of being in power for 18 miserable years the Tories always blame their failings on the previous Labour government! How long did they need for god’s sakes?!

Lulu I agree - the Tories offer us the prospect of George (really Gideon but he changed his name)Osborne as Chancellor of the Exchequer.

A public schoolboy, son of a baronet, with no credentials at all. The only jobs he has had were data entry for the NHS and a small stint at Selfridges before ending up at Tory HQ. (Apparently he wanted to be a journalist but nobody would employ him.)
Amazingly there are people who honestly believe that this unqualified and totally inexperienced man is capable of handling the economy at this precarious time. God help us all.

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Spot on MSMolly.

59

@ lulu - Brown studied history at university.

The fundamental probelm with the NHS is that the country has to be prepared to spend significantly more, but no one ever seems prepared to do so. I live in Germany and the health service is pretty good - things happen very quickly, you can always choose your doctor and/or hospital. BUT - it costs a lot more. Employees have to contribute around 14% of their salary to the health system. I am self-employed and not privately insured and I pay € 614 / month into the health system. You get what you pay for.

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Hi Linda,
So very sorry you had to see your Father go through such agonies, it must have been dreadful for you and your family to cope with.
My father died in 2007, he was diagnoed 8 years prior to that with Alzheimers, my Mum and l looked after him for nearly 8 years, but sadly he became too ill and double incontienent, the last 3 months of his ‘life’ was spent in what l thought was a caring home, and while most of the staff were good, we found the weekend staff would leave them dirty and unchanged, often sitting in there own mess, after l complained my father was changed at regular times, but what about all those (and there were many) who had no visitors? I went in one day and found his breathing was very chesty, ‘I’ called an ambulance and he spent the next 5 weeks in hospital. His treatment there was no better, they would leave his food on the table and expect him to feed himself, he had no ideal how to eat. My Mum and l went in 3 times a day to feed him, one day l walked in and found his bed tipped up, his head was down and his legs were up in the air, he was in a dreadful state, l screamed at the nurse to lower his bed. This treatment is illegal! and all because he wanted to get out of bed and they said he might wander! This never happened again, but we had to fight for everything.
We knew he didn’t have long, so l decided he was not going to die in hospital, l found a nice home out of our area, and fought with social services to get him in there, they said as it was out of the area, he could not go there, but l knew this to be a untrue. Once l arranged with the home for him to go there l discharged him from hospital, he spent his last week being cared for by caring people, the doctor visited once a day,he was fed, clean, washed and never left alone, and this was not private!
My father was in the RAF, he worked all his life, and he was a person, not an inconvenience. He deserved so much better, if we hadn’t been there for him…All those poor people who have no one to fight for them! When my Mum was in hospital last year for 9 months, l saw elderly ladies left half undressed, wet themselves because no nurse came when they called, and as usual there food was left on a tray, with no help for those that could not feed themselves.
Whereas my treatment in hospital last Month was 100% I could not fault them, but then l am ‘young’ (63) and can look after myself, and stick up for myself!
Sandra x